Sumea Challenge #4 -3D- 'nealb4me' - Challenger #7

Submitted by nealb4me on
Forum
Sumea Modeller Challenge

Hi all,

Here is my concept for the comp. Its not my usual style, so i hope ya'll like it. I wont start modelling it for a while yet as i still have another 3 projects going at the moment. Suggestions please

[img] http://nealb4me.customer.netspace.net.au/site/Concept.jpg [/img]

Submitted by JonathanKerr on Sat, 30/08/03 - 8:51 PMPermalink

Not bad - the proportions are a little off. Beef up the arms a wee bit, particularly in the bicep area.

It looks a bit like a polar bear (I think that may be due to the lightness of the scan), which I think would be a great idea for a demon. A hell which is cold - not hot. The old 'when hell freezes over' adage thrown out the window.

Don't know what to suggest really, but you need some sort of a motif or running theme throughout, there doesn't seem to be enough to the character. If it is a cold climate demon, then perhaps some sort of fur or viking style costume is needed.

Submitted by Makk on Mon, 01/09/03 - 10:00 AMPermalink

Wow, there sure are a lot of entries!!
I like the idea of a wolf type character you have going here.
Suggestions would include losing the horns as I find they conflict abit with the wolfs head. Try keeping hi anatomy more wolf like as well (the legs for example) instead of humanish. I would beef up the anatomy a little too, giving him a bulky chest and arms. Maybe throw some dark fur (with stripes) and glowing eyes (glowing eyes = teh evilness!!!2# )into the mix as well.
Have you you ever played the game Black and White, they have great evil looking animals, you might want to check that out.

Submitted by nealb4me on Tue, 02/09/03 - 1:04 AMPermalink

Thanks guys that really helps me out a bit.

I was deliberately keeping the arms slender but i guess thats not really the right way to go. I had experimented with human vs wolf hindlegs and found it really difficult to pull off the look that he is standing comfortably on hindlegs : As for the horns i think i'm going to keep those and give him some sort of slash marks across his skin and back area.

I will endeavor to update soon

Submitted by Malus on Tue, 02/09/03 - 1:18 AMPermalink

I agree with Makk on the humanism issue of your concept, try deforming his shape, make it look more beast like, Hunched shoulders as if its not evolved to the degree that makes bipedal travel comfortable.

Also add some fur to areas of the body (shoulders, chest, forarms etc), that will help tie the body and head together and stop it from looking like the head is cut off an animal and pasted on a human.

Submitted by JonathanKerr on Tue, 02/09/03 - 7:33 PMPermalink

quote:Originally posted by nealb4me

Thanks guys that really helps me out a bit.

I was deliberately keeping the arms slender but i guess thats not really the right way to go.

It'd be fine, look at some of the slender demons on display already (Makk's entry springs to mind). It's just that you'd need to adjust the size of the head accordingly.

Even something like a tail would work - I don't think many entries have a tail -- there's some good scope for ideas there.

Submitted by goodgod on Thu, 11/09/03 - 11:28 AMPermalink

The concept art kind of reminds me of that old show Biker Mice from Mars, but not, if you know what I mean. And also the concept has a lot of proportion problems, such as the head turned but the horns still look like they are face on.

Submitted by nealb4me on Sat, 13/09/03 - 1:13 AMPermalink

Ok I finally got this scanned. This is my new concept which i will start in 3d soon, i think it is a lot better what say u? I imagine it to be fighting off a pack of wolves in the snow and throwing them in the air all crazy-like. I have decided to call it "Arctic Demon"

[img]http://nealb4me.customer.netspace.net.au/site/beast front.jpg[/img]

Submitted by ironikart on Sat, 13/09/03 - 1:43 AMPermalink

Nice work adjusting the concept. He's looking more beast like now. It's just personal preference, but I think those spike things on his hand would look better if they were more organic.. perhaps growing out of the skin. The chain and the metal look a little out of place.

Submitted by inglis (not verified) on Sat, 13/09/03 - 4:00 AMPermalink

i love the demon wolf/bear idea, it's very american indian.

Submitted by Sorceror Bob (not verified) on Sat, 13/09/03 - 7:43 AMPermalink

yer it looks cool. but i think it needs more features amongst the stomack and neck area. maybe a few scars or scratches. he could be missin an eye from that time he scratched his nose.

Submitted by jacobt on Fri, 19/09/03 - 10:46 AMPermalink

Nice shape overall (the rear shots are kinda cool :))... your first sketch had some nice musculature happening, maybe try to model by the beast's anatomy instead of overall mass.

There seems to be a quite a bit of polygons wasted, with the arms in yer second drawing, you could get away with a couple of loops for the elbow and that's it. Chop out any polys that don't add to the silhouette or contour.

Keep at it, start by chopping out those unused edges and then update again [;)]

Are the edges coming out unsymmetrical at render or in your viewport?

Submitted by nealb4me on Fri, 19/09/03 - 11:45 PMPermalink

Yer thanks for that. I used a gradient material to create the edged face look, using face mapping. Theres not really much control over how it does it.

I'm busy with the head atm so that will be availible for viewing soon.

Submitted by nealb4me on Tue, 23/09/03 - 6:44 AMPermalink

Heres a bit of an update with textures so far. Tell me what u think.

I am planning to redo the fur and also the head/arms are not yet completed (texture). I was wondering also if i could get away with a separate 256x256 for the head and a 512x512 for the body?

Also the eyes are not yet demonic enough, what do you think I can do with them? I was thinking removed with blood running down its face.

[img]http://nealb4me.customer.netspace.net.au/site/render_13.jpg[/img]

Submitted by Makk on Tue, 23/09/03 - 8:10 AMPermalink

Yes you need more a stronger texture there for the fur, this one just looks like faint lines. Look at some pics of bear fur for an idea.
Well the rules say for one 512x512 texture sheet or 4 256x256 ones. Maybe use one 256 for the head and split the body into the other 3 texture sheets.
As for the eyes, well I think they are a little small firstly. Secondly the shape of the eye can give him more of a menacing expression. Adding those stripes of fur like on the second concept would help too.
Are those metal claws finished? the highlights on them look a little strange. It looks like you have painted the highlights the one colour, all the way around. The further down the spike the stronger the highlight would be, and at the top of the claw it wouldnt be as strong. Try adding a subtle texture overlay to the claw aswell.
I like dirt and discolouring of his fur, and the scars help too. good work there.
Hope this is of some help :)

Submitted by ironikart on Tue, 23/09/03 - 8:26 AMPermalink

I did a polar bear for sumea comp #3. If you like you can take a look at the fur texture I did for that. I used an offwhite for the base and burnt darker yellows over the top for the hair (along with a combination of some slight photosampling, which isn't allowed for this comp... but you can gain a bit of insight as to how the fur should look).

Submitted by Pantmonger on Tue, 23/09/03 - 5:46 PMPermalink

This is just my opinion I?m no authority on these things but I think splitting a 512 into 4 256 is a bad idea as with 4 smaller maps your uvws have to line up with more straight edges thus more wasted texture space in an organic model. With a single 512 you can interlock the textures more, jigsaw like and you only have half the area in straight lines to line up with.

To give that fur some depth and greater fur like qualities (I am assuming you are using Photoshop) make several layers use a drop shadow on each of these layers (just a little bit) and build up you fur layer by layer with darker fur at the bottom, lighter at the top. The drop shadow will add the depth.

Pantmonger

Submitted by nealb4me on Thu, 25/09/03 - 4:02 AMPermalink

Hey here is my final entry, money shot and uv layout to come. Cheers for the comments guys they have helped me to reach this point. This is my first ever low poly character and I am quite pleased with the result, next time will be be twice as fast and twice as good :P I hope to have my site up soon so ya'll can check out my high poly stuff.

Pantmonger: I have gone with the single 512

ironikart: I had a look at your bear, I think u captured the fur really well however I wanted my character to be more dirty and scungy

Makk: I just gave him a bit of eye shadow to bring the eyes out more

[img]http://nealb4me.customer.netspace.net.au/site/Front_final.jpg[/img]
[img]http://nealb4me.customer.netspace.net.au/site/Rear_final.jpg[/img]
[img]http://nealb4me.customer.netspace.net.au/site/orthographics copy.jpg[/img]
[img]http://nealb4me.customer.netspace.net.au/site/main_tex_512.jpg[/img]

Submitted by davidcoen on Thu, 25/09/03 - 8:38 AMPermalink

the claws came out well, but the poor guys look as if he hasent been fed in a long while, i tend to picture bears being a lot thicker.... and picking fur for a contest stipulating 'no photosourcing' is just machoistic, (i have only be able to 'draw' fur to date by using a scanner....)

something boring i tend to do on being asked to make 'animal based models' is to try and find some anotomical/ bone structure references to draw of any similar type creature to find out what the proportions could be like, otherwise 'people in rubber suit' desisease seems to infect the model....

so at the end of this comp, all the demond lords are going to fight?

Submitted by souri on Mon, 29/09/03 - 8:32 AMPermalink

Post that uv layout + money shot pic as soon as you can please! You're challenger #7.

Posted by nealb4me on
Forum
Sumea Modeller Challenge

Hi all,

Here is my concept for the comp. Its not my usual style, so i hope ya'll like it. I wont start modelling it for a while yet as i still have another 3 projects going at the moment. Suggestions please

[img] http://nealb4me.customer.netspace.net.au/site/Concept.jpg [/img]

Submitted by JonathanKerr on Sat, 30/08/03 - 8:51 PMPermalink

Not bad - the proportions are a little off. Beef up the arms a wee bit, particularly in the bicep area.

It looks a bit like a polar bear (I think that may be due to the lightness of the scan), which I think would be a great idea for a demon. A hell which is cold - not hot. The old 'when hell freezes over' adage thrown out the window.

Don't know what to suggest really, but you need some sort of a motif or running theme throughout, there doesn't seem to be enough to the character. If it is a cold climate demon, then perhaps some sort of fur or viking style costume is needed.

Submitted by Makk on Mon, 01/09/03 - 10:00 AMPermalink

Wow, there sure are a lot of entries!!
I like the idea of a wolf type character you have going here.
Suggestions would include losing the horns as I find they conflict abit with the wolfs head. Try keeping hi anatomy more wolf like as well (the legs for example) instead of humanish. I would beef up the anatomy a little too, giving him a bulky chest and arms. Maybe throw some dark fur (with stripes) and glowing eyes (glowing eyes = teh evilness!!!2# )into the mix as well.
Have you you ever played the game Black and White, they have great evil looking animals, you might want to check that out.

Submitted by nealb4me on Tue, 02/09/03 - 1:04 AMPermalink

Thanks guys that really helps me out a bit.

I was deliberately keeping the arms slender but i guess thats not really the right way to go. I had experimented with human vs wolf hindlegs and found it really difficult to pull off the look that he is standing comfortably on hindlegs : As for the horns i think i'm going to keep those and give him some sort of slash marks across his skin and back area.

I will endeavor to update soon

Submitted by Malus on Tue, 02/09/03 - 1:18 AMPermalink

I agree with Makk on the humanism issue of your concept, try deforming his shape, make it look more beast like, Hunched shoulders as if its not evolved to the degree that makes bipedal travel comfortable.

Also add some fur to areas of the body (shoulders, chest, forarms etc), that will help tie the body and head together and stop it from looking like the head is cut off an animal and pasted on a human.

Submitted by JonathanKerr on Tue, 02/09/03 - 7:33 PMPermalink

quote:Originally posted by nealb4me

Thanks guys that really helps me out a bit.

I was deliberately keeping the arms slender but i guess thats not really the right way to go.

It'd be fine, look at some of the slender demons on display already (Makk's entry springs to mind). It's just that you'd need to adjust the size of the head accordingly.

Even something like a tail would work - I don't think many entries have a tail -- there's some good scope for ideas there.

Submitted by goodgod on Thu, 11/09/03 - 11:28 AMPermalink

The concept art kind of reminds me of that old show Biker Mice from Mars, but not, if you know what I mean. And also the concept has a lot of proportion problems, such as the head turned but the horns still look like they are face on.

Submitted by nealb4me on Sat, 13/09/03 - 1:13 AMPermalink

Ok I finally got this scanned. This is my new concept which i will start in 3d soon, i think it is a lot better what say u? I imagine it to be fighting off a pack of wolves in the snow and throwing them in the air all crazy-like. I have decided to call it "Arctic Demon"

[img]http://nealb4me.customer.netspace.net.au/site/beast front.jpg[/img]

Submitted by ironikart on Sat, 13/09/03 - 1:43 AMPermalink

Nice work adjusting the concept. He's looking more beast like now. It's just personal preference, but I think those spike things on his hand would look better if they were more organic.. perhaps growing out of the skin. The chain and the metal look a little out of place.

Submitted by inglis (not verified) on Sat, 13/09/03 - 4:00 AMPermalink

i love the demon wolf/bear idea, it's very american indian.

Submitted by Sorceror Bob (not verified) on Sat, 13/09/03 - 7:43 AMPermalink

yer it looks cool. but i think it needs more features amongst the stomack and neck area. maybe a few scars or scratches. he could be missin an eye from that time he scratched his nose.

Submitted by jacobt on Fri, 19/09/03 - 10:46 AMPermalink

Nice shape overall (the rear shots are kinda cool :))... your first sketch had some nice musculature happening, maybe try to model by the beast's anatomy instead of overall mass.

There seems to be a quite a bit of polygons wasted, with the arms in yer second drawing, you could get away with a couple of loops for the elbow and that's it. Chop out any polys that don't add to the silhouette or contour.

Keep at it, start by chopping out those unused edges and then update again [;)]

Are the edges coming out unsymmetrical at render or in your viewport?

Submitted by nealb4me on Fri, 19/09/03 - 11:45 PMPermalink

Yer thanks for that. I used a gradient material to create the edged face look, using face mapping. Theres not really much control over how it does it.

I'm busy with the head atm so that will be availible for viewing soon.

Submitted by nealb4me on Tue, 23/09/03 - 6:44 AMPermalink

Heres a bit of an update with textures so far. Tell me what u think.

I am planning to redo the fur and also the head/arms are not yet completed (texture). I was wondering also if i could get away with a separate 256x256 for the head and a 512x512 for the body?

Also the eyes are not yet demonic enough, what do you think I can do with them? I was thinking removed with blood running down its face.

[img]http://nealb4me.customer.netspace.net.au/site/render_13.jpg[/img]

Submitted by Makk on Tue, 23/09/03 - 8:10 AMPermalink

Yes you need more a stronger texture there for the fur, this one just looks like faint lines. Look at some pics of bear fur for an idea.
Well the rules say for one 512x512 texture sheet or 4 256x256 ones. Maybe use one 256 for the head and split the body into the other 3 texture sheets.
As for the eyes, well I think they are a little small firstly. Secondly the shape of the eye can give him more of a menacing expression. Adding those stripes of fur like on the second concept would help too.
Are those metal claws finished? the highlights on them look a little strange. It looks like you have painted the highlights the one colour, all the way around. The further down the spike the stronger the highlight would be, and at the top of the claw it wouldnt be as strong. Try adding a subtle texture overlay to the claw aswell.
I like dirt and discolouring of his fur, and the scars help too. good work there.
Hope this is of some help :)

Submitted by ironikart on Tue, 23/09/03 - 8:26 AMPermalink

I did a polar bear for sumea comp #3. If you like you can take a look at the fur texture I did for that. I used an offwhite for the base and burnt darker yellows over the top for the hair (along with a combination of some slight photosampling, which isn't allowed for this comp... but you can gain a bit of insight as to how the fur should look).

Submitted by Pantmonger on Tue, 23/09/03 - 5:46 PMPermalink

This is just my opinion I?m no authority on these things but I think splitting a 512 into 4 256 is a bad idea as with 4 smaller maps your uvws have to line up with more straight edges thus more wasted texture space in an organic model. With a single 512 you can interlock the textures more, jigsaw like and you only have half the area in straight lines to line up with.

To give that fur some depth and greater fur like qualities (I am assuming you are using Photoshop) make several layers use a drop shadow on each of these layers (just a little bit) and build up you fur layer by layer with darker fur at the bottom, lighter at the top. The drop shadow will add the depth.

Pantmonger

Submitted by nealb4me on Thu, 25/09/03 - 4:02 AMPermalink

Hey here is my final entry, money shot and uv layout to come. Cheers for the comments guys they have helped me to reach this point. This is my first ever low poly character and I am quite pleased with the result, next time will be be twice as fast and twice as good :P I hope to have my site up soon so ya'll can check out my high poly stuff.

Pantmonger: I have gone with the single 512

ironikart: I had a look at your bear, I think u captured the fur really well however I wanted my character to be more dirty and scungy

Makk: I just gave him a bit of eye shadow to bring the eyes out more

[img]http://nealb4me.customer.netspace.net.au/site/Front_final.jpg[/img]
[img]http://nealb4me.customer.netspace.net.au/site/Rear_final.jpg[/img]
[img]http://nealb4me.customer.netspace.net.au/site/orthographics copy.jpg[/img]
[img]http://nealb4me.customer.netspace.net.au/site/main_tex_512.jpg[/img]

Submitted by davidcoen on Thu, 25/09/03 - 8:38 AMPermalink

the claws came out well, but the poor guys look as if he hasent been fed in a long while, i tend to picture bears being a lot thicker.... and picking fur for a contest stipulating 'no photosourcing' is just machoistic, (i have only be able to 'draw' fur to date by using a scanner....)

something boring i tend to do on being asked to make 'animal based models' is to try and find some anotomical/ bone structure references to draw of any similar type creature to find out what the proportions could be like, otherwise 'people in rubber suit' desisease seems to infect the model....

so at the end of this comp, all the demond lords are going to fight?

Submitted by souri on Mon, 29/09/03 - 8:32 AMPermalink

Post that uv layout + money shot pic as soon as you can please! You're challenger #7.