Holiday head

Hey Moony, good to see you back on the 3d wagon (now if I could just do the same).

This is coming along well, I wont crit the mesh work as there are far more experienced sumeans who could do that.

There are a few proportion issues that could be tweaked-
Basicly in profile view, the head equals three and a half the times the height of the forehead, so in profile the size of the head can equal an exact square-
[img]http://members.optusnet.com.au/~rowanfamily/headgrid01.jpg[/img]

Using this grid on your mesh we can see a few things that you could tweak-
[img]http://members.optusnet.com.au/~rowanfamily/headgrid02.jpg[/img]
Basicly-
nose could be pulled out more in profile
forehead too short
move eyes up tad.
lips lowered or chin brought up
neck/jaw area lowered abit so his chin isnt as pronounced

For the front view, its slightly different. divide up a grid as 3.5 units high and 2.5 units wide-
[img]http://members.optusnet.com.au/~rowanfamily/headgridfront01.jpg[/img]

We can see a couple of things that you might want to tweak-
eyes could be a bit wider (also check the shape of them, the highest point of the eye should be towards the outside, where as yours look a little to far inside. ugh! cant explain well, just check some ref!)
..and well, you can have a go and work out the rest yourself!! :)
Heres is a pic to help out-
[img]http://members.optusnet.com.au/~rowanfamily/headgridfront02.jpg[/img]

And to show you them how they both all line up together-
[img]http://members.optusnet.com.au/~rowanfamily/headgrid_both.jpg[/img]

phew! if you have managed to read all of this thanks, I hope you get as much out of it as I did. Also, I apoligise if Im wrong! Im still learning all this stuff.....and its really late and Im tired!! :P

Thanks a heap for that makk, thats helped a lot. Unfortunatly my print screen buttons... gone weird on me and all ive managed to get is this side shot for the minute :S

[img]http://www.sumea.com.au/forum/attached/MoonUnit/200619225140_sideupdate…]

as you can see though your pictures have helped imporve the proportions alot (speaking of which i was wondering if i could get a copy of the silouhette one without my guys mug in it). On the mesh side of things ive edited a tad and everytime i post an image i can allready see things that need changing so rest assured thats coming together slowly but surely aswell allthough your crits are allways welcome.

That is looking better Moony :D

Here is the image you wanted-
http:members.optusnet.com.au/~rowanfamily/head.jpg

[img]http://www.jistyles.com/content/temp/forum%20images/moonyhelp_head01.gi…]

Heya Moony, as promised, here's a quick paint over -- don't take it as gospel since it's totally from my head. Red is a "classicism" proportioned head, and blue is what's called the effect marks... so basically, red is the stereotyped proportional relations between features, most notably different is the eyes sink in, the browline is formed, and the male head is more biased in the temple... then there's a few other more minor feature landmarks etc. The blue is a bit more hard to explain. The effect marks are the mid points where the myological layer (muscles and skeleton) interacts. It's not the skull line, but the connection between muscle and skull and how they interact. There's a lot more to it than what I've drawn, but these are the main points, and it's open to interpretation depending on your character (eg, more pronounced with age). So, the blue you don't necessarily see depending your character, but it affects the surface topology.

thanks makk, and thanks for helping out styles :) Your paint over is helping me see the niggly things i knew were there that were keeping my head from looking like a more realistic one (lips and eyes definetly looked wrong). Ill have to update him soon as i just finished a short project (posted in the speed3d thread) so now i can spare some time. Wouldnt have a link to a overview of some theory on muscles and the myological layer would you? sounds like something worth understanding properly.

OK! I'm going to leave this window open for a while and just rant [;)] ready? GO!

Unfortunately there's only a trickle of truly useful resources on the net compared to other places - most all traditional study sources are housed away in books and crammed inside teachers heads in places like Art Schools and Ateliers - sooooo, I'd recommend grabbing a few $10-30 books from your local Dimmocks or A&R. There's usually a heap of cheaper drawing ones which go over basic anatomy and structure, and then "anatomy for artists" type ones which just show pictorially the forms (it's then up to you to study that and make note of them - I found these the most use... just sit down for a day and copy each and every drawing out on paper; you learn quick! [:)]).

In terms of what you 'need' to know, and a direction to head in, try and concentrate on your primary forms and then start to recognise secondary ones. Everybody knows the primary forms of the face (eyes, mouth, nose, ears), but actually knowing how and where they sit in relation to each other takes time to get used to mapping out. Secondary forms are different - not many people consciously recognise them, or even acknowledge them, but they certainly know when they're wrong or missing. Secondary forms are things like the muzzle shape (how the lip forms lines through to the nose), the V indent of the forehead connecting to the browline, and the upside U shape of the muscles seperating the lower lip and chin. At this point, I may as well say it - knowing names of muscles is useless compared to knowing where they're attached to. I'm trying to communicate certain muscle groups, but it's much easier to just describe a "V of the forehead" than say the frontalis terminating to the orbicularis oculi. Most people would just smile and start backing away slowly[:D]

So, in terms of the head... it's the most recognisable thing you're ever going to try and communicate, so it's difficult to say the least to effectively portray something realistic. Getting the primary elements spot on is absolutely essential, but it's not until you've got a good grip on secondary forms is it going to start to all come togethor successfully and be "right". This means that it's a bit frustrating because it takes a while to get to that point until suddenly it starts all coming togethor, so on closing I'll say keep at it - even if you don't feel like you're making much progress at times, keep going and it will all start to make sense and eventually become second nature.

good luck! And please excuse the ranty-ness of this post, it was pretty much a brain dump of my thoughts on the subject and what I think could help you out [:)]

hey im allways thankfull for a brain dump. Its a pity every time i cruze by here i dont actually have time to work on the thing >.< but thanks again for your help man, thisll steer me in the right direction

EDIT: well ive had a chance to play around a little, heres what he looks like now:

[img]http://www.sumea.com.au/forum/attached/MoonUnit/20061262478_postjiupdat…]

im really starting to like how he looks in the side view, the front is yet to really seem acurate though... any helps apreciated! also his ears are staying the sorta flat things they are for the moment. I had a shot at detailing the ear in 3d and that ended up rather messy. I did say i wanted this guy to be middle ground ingame quality so i dont think extensive ear detail is necesary...